Why are Australians abandoning both major parties, and why are so many turning to Pauline Hanson’s One Nation?
Claire Lehmann speaks with columnist Gemma Tognini about a government she argues will not take responsibility for its mistakes, the spending and regulation she says are driving investment offshore, and the rise in antisemitism that, in her view, political leaders failed to confront before the Bondi terror attack.
They also discuss why conservatives lost their reputation for compassion, why social programmes work better when run locally, what Claire saw as a graduate in Australia’s federal Department of Health, the case for nuclear power, and how to attract better people into politics.
Gemma Tognini is a columnist for The Australian and the founder of a corporate affairs firm. She spent more than a decade in broadcast journalism, including as chief of staff at the Seven Network.
Read her Alboverse article in The Australian here: https://www.theaustralian.com.au/inqu...
📖 Read the full transcript: coming soon
🔗 Mentioned in this episode:
Bondi Was Not a Surprise: https://quillette.com/2025/12/15/bond...
The Party of the Worker Is Now the Party of the Bureaucrat (Claire Lehmann): https://quillette.com/2026/06/19/the-...
The 7 Deadly Myths by Alex Ryvchin: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0CFXWMXQL?...00:00 Intro
00:26 Podcast begins, Albanese and a government that won’t take responsibility
02:15 Labor’s factions and the shift to One Nation
04:36 Paying for the demands of a wealthy society
06:54 Compassion that actually reaches vulnerable people
09:11 Why welfare works better when run locally
11:28 Fiscal management and the Treasurer
13:45 Bondi as a political turning point
15:52 Antisemitism among educated Australians
18:09 The forgotten history of European antisemitism
20:01 What schools don’t teach about antisemitism
22:35 The ABC, media trust and Gemma’s career
25:24 Why policymakers need real-world experience
28:16 Capital flight and Australia’s doom loop
30:45 How to sell spending cuts
33:16 Claire’s year inside the Department of Health
35:24 Service NSW and the power of political will
37:44 Nuclear power, data centres and state competition
40:17 Payroll tax and the case for small business
41:38 Getting better people into politics
45:20 Why the centre-right cedes culture
47:37 The personal cost of speaking out
50:00 The government’s biggest vulnerability
Subscribe for more conversations from Quillette. Read more at https://quillette.com
