Jenny Curtin partners with schools and districts across New England on behalf of the Barr Foundation, where she helps build and scale Transformative Learning Experiences — rigorous, project-based units developed with partner Springpoint that pull students out of the classroom and into courtrooms, communities, and real business ventures.
Her work runs on a philanthropic value most funders don't practice: taking the long view, and staying with schools through the slow, unglamorous work of actual change.
A student named Buddha dropped out of high school after years of disconnected, irrelevant coursework — and became his graduation class speaker after enrolling somewhere that taught differently. Jenny Curtin of the Barr Foundation joins the show to explain the model behind that turnaround, and why most school transformation efforts stall before they ever reach a kid like him.
🫶 What You'll Learn
- Why "taking the long view" beats chasing the next quick fix in school reform
- How to design school changes around your most marginalized students first
- What a Transformative Learning Experience unit actually looks like in practice
- Why community with other school leaders is what sustains multi-year change efforts
🔨 Breaking Down the Old Rules 🧠 Key Insight #1: Why School Transformation Requires Slowing Down First
- What's broken: Schools chase quick fixes and bolt-on programs instead of questioning their actual purpose and vision.
- The shift: Leaders take the long view — slowing down to investigate vision, gather empathy interviews, and study other school models before acting.
- Impact: Change becomes sustainable enough to survive leadership turnover instead of collapsing the moment its champion leaves.
🧠 Key Insight #2: Why Centering Marginalized Students Redesigns the Whole School
- What's broken: Most school redesign starts from the average student and treats the most marginalized students as an afterthought.
- The shift: Design at the margins first — build for the students least served by the current system, then let that design benefit everyone.
- Impact: A school that centred a disconnected, disengaged dropout re-enrolled him — and he graduated as class speaker.
🧠 Key Insight #3: Why Project-Based Learning Beats Traditional Coursework
- What's broken: Traditional coursework asks students to check a box for a diploma without connecting it to their real lives.
- The shift: Transformative Learning Experiences put students in real courtrooms for moot trials, real neighbourhoods for gentrification photography projects, and real business plans built with math skills.
- Impact: Students report a deeper sense of their own potential, and even early-adopter teachers say the model shifted what they believe is possible for kids.
🎧 JENNY CURTIN QUOTES FROM THE RUCKUSCAST
"The silver bullets that are always coming on the scene for education are a trap."
— Jenny Curtin
"We're not interested in people just adding more decorations onto an existing cake."
— Jenny Curtin
"If we aren't ever designing at those margins of who isn't being served well, we're never going to get to those young people."
— Jenny Curtin
"There's like many different, beautiful high school models that can exist that do not have to look all the same."
— Jenny Curtin
"We're not interested in making marginal changes to make things marginally better for young people."
— Jenny Curtin
✍️ Your Do School Different Challenge
Ready to implement? Start here:
- Tomorrow: Pull up your school's current improvement plan and circle every initiative that's a bolt-on program rather than a rebuilt foundation.
- This Month: Shadow three students who are least served by your current model and document what they actually need.
- This Semester: Pilot one project-based, community-connected unit — like a moot court trial or a local-issue investigation — with a single grade or department.
🚀 Episode Timestamps
- 00:00 - Why there are no quick fixes in education
- 03:28 - Buddha's story: from dropout to class speaker
- 08:18 - Why the system wasn't built to serve every student
- 10:38 - Centering the most marginalized students first
- 12:10 - The cake analogy: stop decorating, start re-baking
- 14:35 - What taking the long view actually means
- 19:33 - Why school leaders need community, not isolation
- 26:09 - Inside Transformative Learning Experiences: Students in the Law
- 28:31 - Taking learning beyond the school walls
- 30:40 - How project-based learning shifts staff mindset
- 33:26 - How high-impact leaders sustain change over years
- 37:23 - Jenny's marquee message and three principles for a dream school
💌 Connect With Jenny Curtin
Website: https://www.barrfoundation.org/
LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/jennycurtin
🎧 Listen & Subscribe
Listen to Better Leaders Better Schools on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Youtube or wherever you get your podcasts. If today's episode moved you, leave a review — it helps more Ruckus Makers find the show.
🧔🏻♂️ Your SelfMentorship Guide
Meet Digital Danny — your SelfMentorship guide. Always available, never forgets, and evolves with you. Think through your next leadership move at myprincipalcoach.com
🫶 Today's RuckusCast Partners
ODP Business Solutions has been the behind-the-scenes partner for schools for three decades — not just competitive pricing, but negotiated cooperative contracts that stretch every dollar. They helped Baldwin School District overhaul its entire campus without blowing the budget, combining smart design with smarter purchasing. From essential supplies to cutting-edge tech to flexible furniture, it's one supplier instead of ten separate headaches.
Visit ODPbusiness.com/education to see what they can do for your district.
Frontline Education's 2026 K12 Lens Report makes one thing clear: retention, not just hiring, is what determines staffing stability. Districts running structured, automated professional growth software report easier hiring nearly half the time — compared to just 30% of districts without it. If you're building a campus where great educators actually want to stay, this report is your blueprint.
Get it free at FrontlineEducation.com/leaders
IXL kills the guesswork in lesson planning — teachers get ready-made, standards-aligned lessons built for exactly what their textbooks already cover. Add daily insight into student performance and teachers can adjust instruction before a gap becomes a pattern. Your teachers get the tool, your students get the growth.
Start at IXL.com/leaders
META DESCRIPTION: Barr Foundation's Jenny Curtin on why real high school transformation starts with slowing down, not adding another program.
