Fresh out of the studio, Jing Yang, Asia Bureau Chief at The Information, joins us to explore how China is building frontier AI under chip constraints, state capital, and open source ambition. Jing breaks down her scoop on DeepSeek's $7.4 billion round at a $50 billion valuation, unpacking a deal structure in which the founder wrote two-fifths of the check and outside investors got no voting rights. She explains why Chinese AI valuations trail US labs, why seven to eight language model players refuse to consolidate, and why DeepSeek chose Huawei chips before Huawei knew about it. Last but not least, Jing shares the indicators she is watching from now to 2027.
"This is one of the things that really surprised me when I was working on this story: DeepSeek had spent a lot of time last year retrofitting their models and software with Huawei chips. I think a lot of people assumed it's because the government ordered DeepSeek to work with Huawei to embrace the domestic ecosystem, but it's actually the opposite. It was DeepSeek that voluntarily started using Huawei, experimenting with the Huawei chips, and Huawei actually only found out after. Then they started sending people to DeepSeek to help..." - Jing Yang, Asia Bureau Chief, The Information
Episode Highlights:[00:00] Quote of the Day by Jing Yang from The Information
[01:30] What changed since September: the ByteDance mystery resolved
[03:00] Why China's AI must be read on its own terms
[04:10] Breaking the story of DeepSeek on their 7.4B fundraise
[05:40] How the valuation went from $10 to $50 billion
[08:30] The lab that became famous for rejecting scaling laws
[10:15] Unpacking the DeepSeek deal structure: four types of investors
[12:40] Five-year lock-up and no secondary market trading
[14:20] Reverse due diligence: DeepSeek vetting its own investors
[16:40] Balancing open source, AGI research and IPO pressure
[17:45] The irony: inclusive vision, exclusive deal structure
[20:35] How Anthropic's Mythos preview changed Liang's mind[21:30] Why Chinese AI valuations look tiny next to US labs
[23:00] Why Chinese founders go consumer when they go global
[26:45] "The worst of customers" — price sensitivity and zero loyalty
[27:45] The compute constraint that caps every Chinese lab
[28:40] New labs in China: weaker infrastructure, harder exit
[30:30] Can China leapfrog on hardware the way it did on models?
[32:50] Stricter compliance, not political muscle
[34:30] Founder power when your company becomes strategic
[36:40] Junyang Lin's new lab and the scarcity premium
[38:00] Open source influence versus sustainable commercial models
[39:30] Zhipu versus MiniMax: how sentiment diverged after IPO
[42:30] What is the right mental map for China's AI ecosystem?
[43:20] The consolidation that still hasn't happened
[45:00] Seven to eight serious players and nobody giving up
[46:40] The one thing Jing wishes people would ask
[47:20] Nobody ordered DeepSeek to use Huawei chips
[50:00] Indicators to watch from now to 2027
[55:30] Closing
Profile: Jing Yang, Asia Bureau Chief from The Information
The Information Profile: https://www.theinformation.com/u/JingYang
LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jing-yang-33548123/
X: https://x.com/jingyanghk
Podcast Information: Bernard Leong hosts and produces the show. The proper credits for the intro and end music are "Energetic Sports Drive." G. Thomas Craig mixed and edited the episode in both video and audio format.
