Tom and Jonny sit down with Patrick Lewis, founding designer at Klay. They dig into why "good" and "right" aren't the same thing, how AI has flattened the design experience curve, the pun-named playground he built to prototype without baggage, and why saying no might be the most important design skill right now.
Chapters 0:04 — Meet Patrick Lewis, founding designer at Klay 1:05 — Building Clay: an AI music app made by musicians, not sales bros 2:27 — Content still has to resonate with humans, AI-generated or not 6:27 — Consistency builds trust: designing believable AI video avatars 10:16 — Figma bulls and bears: Jonny's rebuy vs. Patrick's near-total exit 12:37 — Where Figma still earns its place: branding and early sketches 13:42 — Founding designer for the fourth time: getting context fast with AI 16:51 — Building a pun-named playground to prototype without baggage 19:17 — Layoffs, flattened experience curves, and adopt-or-die 27:09 — Knowing yourself, saying no, and the founding designer's tightrope 36:44 — Capacity has grown, but so has the pressure to do it all 39:23 — Quickfire: chairs over AGI, decision-making he won't outsource, and granola
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