Melanie Cave speaks with historian and writer Professor Sarah C Williams about her book 'When Courage Calls', which explores Josephine Butler’s life, activism, and deep prayerfulness. The conversation traces how Butler became a leading voice against the Contagious Diseases Acts, why her work was so controversial, and how her faith shaped every part of her public witness. Sarah shares how researching Butler unexpectedly became a meditation on prayer, courage, grief, and Christian imagination. The episode also connects Butler’s 19th century campaign to present day questions about sexual abuse, pornography, political stamina, and what it means for the church to pursue justice with both conviction and humility.
Key topics
- Sarah C Williams explains how a childhood love of history led to a lifelong academic and writing career, with a passion for helping Christians learn from the past.
- Butler’s significance is introduced through her leadership in exposing Victorian prostitution and challenging the laws that targeted marginalized women rather than men.
- The Contagious Diseases Acts are unpacked in detail, including compulsory examinations for suspected women, incarceration in lock hospitals, and the double standard built into the system.
- Melanie and Sarah discuss why Butler was considered radical, not just because she addressed prostitution publicly, but because she did so with spiritual seriousness and moral clarity.
- Butler’s courage is shown in her public speaking, social ostracism, physical threats, and attacks from both society and parts of the church.
- Sarah highlights Butler’s refusal to separate prayer from action, describing her as someone who prayed daily, organized prayer meetings, and grounded political work in communion with God.
- The book’s structure was shaped by Butler’s own method, especially her use of narrative and biography to invite others into the experience of prayer rather than define it abstractly.
- Butler’s suffering, including depression, burnout, grief, and intense rage, is presented as part of her credibility and her ability to identify with others in pain.
- The conversation reflects on how Butler’s long campaign took 16 years, offering a model of stamina, focused calling, and patient persistence in justice work.
- Sarah suggests that Butler’s legacy speaks directly to current issues such as sexual abuse and internet pornography, especially because she was never squeamish about naming hard realities.
Chapters
00:01 — Melanie introduces When Courage Calls and why Josephine Butler’s story matters.
00:25 — Sarah’s background and love of history
01:15 — Why Sarah was drawn to Butler and why her legacy still matters.
02:21 — A history lesson on The Contagious Diseases Acts that Butler fought against and why they were unjust.
04:36 — Why Butler was considered radical
11:22 — The courage Butler showed in public speaking and the threats she faced.
17:44 — How Butler’s prayer life shaped her campaigning and leadership.
29:34 — A discussion of Butler’s suffering, burnout, and emotional honesty.
32:21 — What courage looked like in Butler’s life and why stamina matters.
37:08 — How Butler’s example speaks to modern justice issues, prayer, and political imagination.
Show notes:
where to get Sarah's book, When Courage Calls https://standrewsbookshop.co.uk/product/when-courage-calls/?srsltid=AfmBOopk0vK3dBc89SxzYN_c8YpazaUwFR_IFG2YfNQl04ebKXUp5s1F
www.rootsforchurches.com
