In this episode, host Elizabeth Pittman sits down with Tim Kurth to discuss his new book, Principles for Good Order: Creating Organizational Harmony Through Effective Governance, which adapts John Carver’s Policy Governance model for Lutheran congregations, schools, and ministry organizations. Drawing on decades of service as a Lutheran school teacher, DCE, and leader at the Lutheran Church Extension Fund, Tim explains why well-meaning board members so often stumble, how executive limitations can actually free pastors to lead, and how confession and absolution can shape the way boards and pastors work together — and he shares why he sees great hope in the next generation of Lutheran leaders.
Get your copy of Principles for Good Order at cph.org/goodorder.
Episode Timestamps
0:00 — Introduction & Welcoming Tim Kurth
2:00 — Why Good Order Matters for Lutheran Organizations
4:00 — Why Good People Struggle in the Boardroom
6:00 — The Sunday School Space Expert: A Lesson in Board Boundaries
7:45 — The Pastor, the Food Pantry, and the Power of a Board
10:00 — The Board as Servant Leader of the Voters
13:00 — Why Policies Need to Be Written Down
14:00 — The Three Lanes: Voters, Board, and Pastor
17:30 — Right-Hand and Left-Hand Kingdom Responsibilities
19:30 — Executive Limitations: Why “Shall Not” Can Be Freeing
22:00 — When Limitations Go Too Far
24:30 — Supporting Pastors Who Feel Ill-Equipped to Lead
29:00 — The Supplement to the Diploma of Vocation as a Monitoring Tool
32:00 — How Principles Based Governance Fits Lutheran Confessions and Polity
34:30 — Confession, Repentance, and Absolution in the Boardroom
39:30 — Hope for the Next Generation of Lutheran Leaders
42:45 — Where to Connect with Tim
44:00 — Closing
About the Guest
Tim Kurth retired from his role as Vice President of Ministry Solutions at the Lutheran Church Extension Fund (LCEF) in 2026. Previously, he was a Lutheran school teacher as well as a Director of Christian Education (DCE) for congregations in the Chicago area. Throughout his years of service, Tim helped to start a Lutheran high school and develop international nonprofit ministries. He enjoys participating in short-term missions, which has taken him to a total of six countries. Tim is a father to two and grandfather to three and currently lives in the Indianapolis area.
Resources Mentioned
Principles for Good Order: Creating Organizational Harmony Through Effective Governance by Tim Kurth — cph.org
Tim’s website: principlesbasedgovernance.com
Concordia Publishing House
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LCMS Foundation
Helping congregations grow long-term funding to support ministries 👉 lcmsfoundation.org/podcast
