Max Lesser breaks down how Chinese intelligence services are using fake consulting firms, job listings, LinkedIn, and other online platforms to target former government employees and collect sensitive information at scale. We also discuss AI-enabled espionage, covert influence operations, TikTok and data privacy, and why awareness may be the best defense against increasingly sophisticated virtual recruitment. Find Max here: https://www.fdd.org/team/max-lesser/ Support the show on Patreon:⬇️ https://www.patreon.com/TheTeamHouse Jack's news outlet:⬇️ https://thehighside.substack.com/ Find Jon Hackett here:⬇️ Jon's Twitter: https://x.com/jonathanhackett Jon's LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/thejonathanhackett Jon's books: https://www.amazon.com/stores/author/B0C5L659N5?ccs_id=e11a2062-f8d3-498e-bfd7-7d2f3869caf6 Linkedin: https://www.linkedin.com/in/thejonathanhackett Twitter: https://x.com/jonathanhackett Check out Mick's new podcast here:⬇️ Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/at/podcast/pub-and-porch-applied-stoicism/id1836955475 Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/1k3QPmkAMwnGJxMLDwUSSd?si=n6piIu8XRcag1Z0K43A3bQ Youtube: https://www.youtube.com/@UCd0Hq6QFk8CoTu5j-VU0Ong Find Mick Mulroy here: Fogbow ⬇️ https://fogbow.com/ Lobo Institute ⬇️ https://www.loboinstitute.org/ Twitter ⬇️ https://x.com/mickmulroy?s=21&t=-Ze3F_Ix2vlJ18KFvORTCA LinkedIn ⬇️ https://www.linkedin.com/in/michael-patrick-mulroy-31198b52/ Whitefish security summit ⬇️ https://whitefishsecuritysummit.com Find Marc P here: https://x.com/Mpolymer Find Andy Milburn here: Twitter ⬇️ https://twitter.com/i/flow/login?redirect_after_login=%2Fandymilburn8 LinkedIn ⬇️ https://www.linkedin.com/in/andrewmilburn2023 Substack ⬇️ https://amilburn.substack.com/ Andy’s book ⬇️ https://www.amazon.com/When-Tempest-Gathers-Mogadishu-Operations "Karl Casey @ White Bat Audio" 00:00 – Start 00:59 – China’s New Virtual Espionage Model 02:28 – How Max Discovered a Fake Chinese Consulting Network 06:18 – Why China Targets Former Government Employees 10:09 – What Intelligence Is China Actually Trying to Collect? 15:35 – How Elicitation Works & When You Realize You’ve Gone Too Far 19:42 – Catfishing, Dating Apps & Espionage Online 20:50 – Chinese Intelligence Operations Inside World of Warcraft 22:03 – Are Russian & Chinese Influencers Manipulating Social Media Feeds? 26:47 – China’s Online Influence Operations & TikTok 30:25 – Why Americans Should Care About Chinese Data Collection 36:45 – AI, Fake Websites & the Massive Scale of Chinese Espionage 40:59 – Why Taking Down Spy Websites Won’t Solve the Problem 46:13 – Is China Deliberately Flooding U.S. Counterintelligence? 47:34 – Russia’s “Operation Overload” & Overwhelming Investigators 52:23 – North Korea’s Remote Workers & the New Intelligence Economy 53:00 – Iran, China, Russia & Fake Accounts During the Iran War 57:03 – Where to Find Max Lesser’s Research 58:34 – How Foreign Propaganda Hooks Smart People 1:01:27 – How to Protect Yourself From Virtual Recruitment 1:03:08 – Closing Thoughts
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